Home Society Public transport ‘Utter nonsense!’ – Transport consultant rubbishes PTMP-reclamation model

‘Utter nonsense!’ – Transport consultant rubbishes PTMP-reclamation model

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‘Utter nonsense!’ – Transport consultant rubbishes PTMP-reclamation model

These are my thoughts in the video above on the forum on elevated light rail at Recsam in Penang this afternoon.

Experienced transport consultant Dr Rosli Khan, who is from out of town, said Penang is special in so many ways – the island, the beaches, the hills, the food (sotong bakar at Gurney Drive!). These characteristics, he said, should be preserved.

Unfortunately, “PTMP has been done for a different reason altogether. It is not done on the basis of providing what Penang actually requires. Penang does not require three new islands, for instance.” The crowd applauded in agreement.

Rosli suggested Penang consider a policy to limit car usage rather than car ownership, which has not been tried in this country. But that involves coming up with a good public transport system.

Why not look at what our neighbour Singapore is doing as a good model? “People in Singapore don’t suffer because they don’t own a car. … In fact, the money they are not using for private cars, they can use it for something else.

“The way I look at public transport is different from all the super-rich people who want to take advantage of Penang property prices. The way they look at public transport is different. Forgive me for saying this – but I don’t think they planned these facilities and designed them to the needs and requirements of the people of Penang. They are designing them for something else.

“Because even before they spend any money on public transport, they say, ‘Oh, we have to generate enough cash from the land reclamation so that we can sell all this land first; the profit from the sale of this land, then only we spend on public transport.’ What a rubbish way of looking at it! This is utter nonsense!”

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Rosli pointed out that trams are much cheaper than elevated light rail and they have priority at traffic lights. An elevated light rail system simply cannot be justified in Penang Island, which has just over 700,000 residents. “You don’t need a system that can move 20,000 people an hour. You don’t. You need a simple public transport system where it also controls the usage of cars on the road.”

“LRT is very expensive to build… – because it demands a right of way in order for it to operate. And in a city centre like Penang you have to forgo a lot of land, a lot of old buildings, in order just to put column after column of LRT guideway for it to operate.

“So that is expensive, horrible looking, very ugly; it’s not aesthetic at all. So you don’t want that to be part of your heritage city. I wouldn’t recommend that.

“In fact, I have come across studies that have said that once you build LRT along certain commercial areas or districts, the value of the properties in the area have actually gone down, it doesn’t increase – because the structure is sitting in front of your doorstep, your shoplot, your showroom. People don’t favour that.”

Rosli went on to explain why trams are the best solution for Penang, concurring with the Halcrow masterplan which recommended them, along with bus rapid transit and ferries.

“There is no good reason for Penang to copy Kuala Lumpur’s problematic transport systems” – KTM commuter, mass rapid transit, light rail, monorail – a veritable rojak, which he described as “a nightmare to use”.

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Dr Lim Mah Hui then highlighted the financial risks involved in the elevated rail if the over-optimistic ridership figures were not met. How would the Penang government finance the operating deficits of the elevated light rail, which could reach over RM100m annually? He suggested trackless trams instead which would be so much cheaper to install.

Seberang Perai City Councillor Cameron Kang said the full potential of buses, which are flexible and customisable, has not yet been explored. He urged Prime Minister Dr Mahathir Mohamad to abandon the third national car idea and replace it with a national bus project, which would create lots of new jobs as well.

Finally, Khoo Salma Nasution revealed that the LRT depot would be located on Island A, but Island B would be reclaimed first. The LRT ridership would be just 81,000 day – and that too, only in 2038. But how would it be possible to reach anywhere near that figure when the catchment population along the LRT line (before reclamation is completed) is just 200,000? She also said not many people are aware that an environmental impact assessment for the light rail is now available, but it has not been seen at the LRT booths in various parts of the state.

Make sure you check out Dr Rosli Khan’s full presentation at 2:35:10 in the video below, followed by the excellent presentations by Mah Hui, Cameron and Salma.

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Syam
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Syam

TDM missed giving out the most important message for this gathering of ketuanan Melayu aka Kongres Tongkat ie the Malay Leaders in power must be dignified and not take advantage of the affirmative action to enrich themselves by dubious and corrupt means. Also the need to help non Malays who are poor to promote unity of Malaysians.

Sadhu
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Sadhu

The Federal Constitution already has its provisions with regards to the special position of the Malays, which almost all have accepted. To say that the non-Malays are questioning the Fed Consitution conferring The Federal Constitution already has its provisions with regards to the special position of the Malays, which almost all have accepted. To say that the non-Malays are questioning the Fed Consitution conferring special rights is FAKE NEWS & LIES to destabilise the country. rights is FAKE NEWS & LIES to destabilise the country.

Anfield
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Anfield

“There is no good reason for Penang to copy Kuala Lumpur’s problematic transport systems”

But to emulate Singapore’s system would be “Lao Bin Chui” (losing dignity) to local politicians.

tunglang
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tunglang

PTMP has been done for a different reason altogether:
To create more prime land in the form of 3-exclusive islands on which to build more high-end properties to sell to the rich & famous which will eventually showcase Penang Cosmopolitan vision of Niao Kong, whose purpose + intention is for social engineering of a once liveable island for all Penangites regardless of race, status & socio-economic standing. This is only politically possible via the justification of super high-cost financing of PTMP short of being accused as spendthrift.

Which developer doesn’t want to tango with politicians with such grand scheme of things?

Shriek
Guest

Tulang, if you have money or if you dont gave money is oredi a social engineering. Tulang, you have $£¢€¥, you move out of Wong fei hoong shophouse and live high cost and high rise condos. No money, they are forced to stay in rumah pangsa and join birds of pigeons in pigeon holes.

Anfield
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Anfield

SHAH ALAM: The chief organiser of the Malay Dignity Congress here today reminded other communities of their social contract with Malays, saying it was the basis of giving them citizenship which could be suspended if they break the agreement.

Quoting verses from the Quran, Zainal Kling said Malays, who he claimed “inherited the country for over 5,000 years”, could always suspend their social contract with non-Malays, adding that they were the rightful owners of the land.

Logan Loo
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Logan Loo

What social contract?

British grant us merdeka on conditions that all races to become citizens of country. Why distort the historical fact?

What dignity you are crying for, when NEP is abused to enrich rich malays at the expense of poor ones? Has the rich malays ever contribute to the welfare of poor malays?

Why call for abolition of vernacular schools? Is it because more enlightened Malay parents are now sending their kids to SJK Cina schools for better quality education that can give better future in job employment? Please wake up. Truth hurts but must face it.

Shriek
Guest

What puzzle me and what is the answer. Are non bumi in land below the wind and land of hornbirds under social contract? They were under the British in 1957. Along with Sinkapore, they joined and formed Malaysia. Are Sinkapore orso in social contract when they were in Malaysia?

Anfield
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Anfield

Sabah AMK information chief Razeef Rakimin has told off the academic Zainal Kling over the latter’s speech at the Malay Dignity Congress by insisting that Malaysia belongs to Malaysians.

He said the “social contract” that Zainal cited was an understanding between Alliance Party representatives. It was never a physical document and was superseded by the Malaysia Agreement 1963 when Sabah and Sarawak joined the federation, he said.

Saravanan
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Saravanan

Some local scholars/historians have claimed that we have never been colonised by the British.

If so, why then we sought Merdeka?

tunglang
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tunglang

After I was born, my mom often reminded me these:
“Nobody owes you a living.”
“You have hands & legs.”
“Tantrum won’t reward you”
“Sit (do nothing) & wait to die ah”
“The cane is faster to come than a warning!”

This is just a snippet of parenting in the 60s-70s.

Sadhu
Guest
Sadhu

Today’s mothers are working no time to educate their children, send Children to childcare centres only to watch DVDs and Astro all day long and being influenced to play computer games from young. So we have Poor Discipline kids giving rise to a poorly educated generation!

Anfield
Guest
Anfield

Hong Kong youth engaged in vandalism in the name of democracy bringing destruction to economy and their parents’ own rice bowls. Wonder what their parents are feeling now.

tunglang
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tunglang

Why MTR was vandalised & not others? The main reason is MTR refused to share their CCTV recordings of Police Raptors’ brutal baton + pepper spray attacks of unarmed train commuters, young & old who were on their way home. Many were bleeding from the heads & some went missing from the list of people that 31st August @ Prince Edward Station. And MTR closed the station for 2 days to prevent independent investigation by legal fraternity. The next few days, HK Police said some youth had committed suicide but HK people suspected the dead bodies came from that night… Read more »

Shriek
Guest

Spinner and another MiB. Protesters after vandalising outside they went to MRT to change from black shirts to white. They use umberra inside the the MRT to change their superman costumes. Those mibs protesters vandalised public properties and the polisi have to apprehend them. Those MiB protesters are hero’s when they are thousands. When in tens, they cried when the law is on them People question why MIBs protesters take refuge in mrts. As a result mrts closed for people and MIBs protesters are willing to vandalise and destroy so that ordinary ah pek and ah soh cannot go anywhere… Read more »

Shriek
Guest

Scmp show MiB maskef rioters box a (investment company) worker when he speak mandarin. Now many hkers are living in fear. I have a Malaysian friend who lives in yoko town shopping mall which is linked to yuen long MRT. Now wanted to come. They do not know when MiB masked rioters will attack and burn the MRT or held sing freedom in the shopping mall and discourage shoppers from coming.

Kent Shuang
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Kent Shuang

Tunglang being English educated I supposed only read western media which is biased towards the Hong Kong incident, supporting the rioters vandalising public amenities in the name of human rights and democracy.

Go read the Chinese history on those unequal treaties that the west imposed on China in the past leading to Boxer Rebellion. I suggest tunglang go to Chinese historians to get the right facts!

tunglang
Guest
tunglang

The discourse is about the recent Police brutality against the people in HK, which has nothing to do with old ancient history so to play the blame game of nationalism against white colonialists (if you want to understand the real worthy China nationalism, read Kuomintang, not Mao’s brutal communism). I have seen & heard in the live feeds of both pro-democracy & pro-Beijing in English, Mandarin & Cantonese to understand what actually happened since June & the sequence of events that followed after the many utter failures of Carrie Lam to run HK but being a useless puppet of CCP… Read more »

Shriek
Guest

Tu lang, freedom can do everything and anything thing? There is law and order. Even freedom you have to obey certain laws. You have freedom to jump. But law of gravity comes into effect. Hkers have freedom to protest. Cops did not stop them. But then the MiB protesters break, vandalise and deface the legistrative chambers to a tune of 10million. Is taxpayers money. Yet the hkers do not want them to be charged. Tu lang very happy…. The killer of girlfriend happen in Taiwan will be set free on 23 Oct. The extradition bill was formulated because a HK… Read more »

Shriek
Guest

How you want to treat rioters when throw petrol bombs, shot ball bearings, shine lasers, dig up brick and throw at officers or hunt and hit officers if they are out numbered?
Why a hypocrite as what Yankees did to the Iraqis and others when they are non Christians. Pictures shows they are chained and walk around like dogs? Where is your moral? No kbkb when they are whites? See how white us cops treat the blacks? Yes, you are blind but not mute.

Anfield
Guest
Anfield

Hong Kong history for today’s youth (and those manipulated by western biased media):

tunglang
Guest
tunglang

Undeniable brutality of HK Police Force esp. the Raptors (HK SWAT) begs independent investigation & immediate sacking + purging of the British Police superintendents in HK Police:

Hong Kong protests: Man with bleeding in brain, pregnant woman held in hospital
Read more at https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/politics/article/3032123/man-brain-bleed-and-pregnant-woman-held-hong-kong-hospital?utm_source=thestar&utm_medium=partner&utm_campaign=contentexchange#j7BPwCky3wJSXBLs.99

Shriek
Guest

.They are many times better. Those MIBs went to shopping malls and with hundreds and thousands chased away the shoppers. Who will go shopping when MIBs will bash anyone who disagree with them? As a result, many small shops close or workers had to take reduced workload and unpaid leave. Government allow peaceful protests but now, protests are very violet. Imagine gangs of MiB and masked form 5 students chasing after the cops and hit the cops with iron bars. One cop warn the rioter but he persisted and the cop shot him. It is a serious offence to attack… Read more »

Shriek
Guest

Tu lang, those rioters stop foreigners from taking their planes. You love to be stopped by the rioters from going home? There is a video about a red dressed Thai woman carry her language trying to board her plane. What about her human rights and freedom? Tu lang you treat her like a refugee? The protesters are selfish lot. People want to go to work but they were stopped by rioters blocking the train doors.

Anfield
Guest
Anfield

Catalan protesters and secessionists are using similar tactics as Hong Kong rioters in the past few months on the streets, burning facilities in Catalan towns, paralyzing the airport in Barcelona and wearing masks to avoid arrest, which Chinese experts said would backfire on political elites of the West in their cities even as they continually voice support for Hong Kong rioters and separatists.

http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1167243.shtml

tunglang
Guest
tunglang

Do you know what the unacceptable deeds HK Police did to the students…before you put a judgement on HK youth pro-democracy protestors:

3 shocking news from Oct 10 break the heart of Hong Konger.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8oR9BagaSU
English translation is displayed if you don’t understand Cantonese.
BTW, the English is not fake translation for westerners’ agenda.

Shriek
Guest

Do you know who break the laws first! Who break and deface the HK parliament HSE? Then girl claimed her eye was hit by polisi and yet she went 180 deg turn and do not want police to investigate her medical record. Dont you know protester use ball bearings to shot? Do you know HK police will raise red, black warning flags before taking action? Why not you kbkb at igp to do the same here raise warning flags. Hkers not not protesters but rioters and terrorists. Tulang you very happy and do not wat police to take action when… Read more »

Shriek
Guest

Are we sure he is transport expert? How to limit car usage? By having good public transport. What is good public transport? Tu lang can prove it. He has a car. He tried taking bus which come half hour later. Now he went back to his more reliable 4wd. What kind of expert with no answer? Tram? According to newspapers, there will be class action again the NSW government for business loss in city area. Many shops close down. They are going to sue the government. The builder is a tram expert and yet the project delay for more than… Read more »

tunglang
Guest
tunglang

Who wants to read your shrieking nonsense???
Why not just squat @ Komtar Tower & shoe shine every PGCAT feline for 50cents (to borrow from the HK pro-democracy protest online pro-Beijing trolls earning 50cents for every response from the audience). Pathetic!

Shriek
Guest

You are no 1 online kbkb. So you are no 1 wumao. As usual like black shirt and masked protester talk so much about democrazy. But demand and denial others the right and free dom to speak and want to stop them from speaking.
Truth hurts … kbkb like you. You pokai good in gutter words. You dare not deny that you took rapid bus but waited more than 1/2 hour. So you are back to 4wds again.

tunglang
Guest
tunglang

I don’t own a 4WD anymore, idiot!
Or are you insisting that I drive one, why not you buy me a Landcruiser2? 2nd hand is good enough for me to justify your still nonsense (fake news) at press time!
Now, why should I deny waiting RapidPg that’s not on time schedule? A truth is a truth spoken & not to be denied later on like a shrieking fool full of nonsense! It’s public knowledge of RapidPg service that begs improvement. And I say this without fear or favor towards Penang Forum in the heat of debating PTMP.

Shriek
Guest

Tu lang. Instead of kbkb, why not kbkb on how to improve rapid bus? No idea and no how? In the end, short cut and easy way is to kbkb. Kbkb about building highways. Why dispose the 4wd and use the 4wd to drive up and down the hills. Don’t use roads and highways build by gomen, dude.

tunglang
Guest
tunglang

Talking like a boyscout! Assuming is a dangerous discourse which could land you in court. I don’t own Rapid Pg, so I have no rights to insist my way. It’s up to Rapid to improve customer service or pack up.

Shriek
Guest

… Soon many things you own? Yet you always kbkb this and that. You don’t own but yet want to be action like a pro.

Shriek
Guest

Tulang, why don’t you continue to use public transport? To you what is essential in public transport since you orso have a 4wd?

Wei
Guest
Wei

hehe….so many empty chairs ……where are those 20 thousands that sign the petition…fake accounts ??
now this is clear that people want government’s PTMP not yours….in democratic society,majority wins ….bye bye transport consultant/ ex banker/ elite/ concillor ..LOL