Ignoring Penang NGOS, copying Hong Kong-style ‘development’?

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Photograph: Glamorous Mesh

The chief minister has said that if Hong Kong had taken the advice of Penang NGOs to stop all development following landslides, it would not be as developed as it was today. He said Hong Kong learned the lessons of a major landslide and soon came up with solutions.

The problem is that Penang learned little from the Granito landslide tragedy last year. In fact, the commission of inquiry has not yet even come up with findings. So how could Penang have learned anything?

The lack of monitoring was evident in the Bukit Kukus tragedy a year later, even after a warning sign from a ‘crane accident’ a week earlier.

Is the state government worried that Penang will be left behind or ‘backward’ and so it wants to drag us by the scruff of the neck to greater heights of ‘development’ – never mind the consequences?

But what exactly is the state government’s vision of ‘development’? A concrete jungle? High-rise buildings all over, even on hill-sides (even while we lack effective monitoring of hill-side development)? Hotels and more ‘development’ (complete with cable cars) on the Penang Hill summit? Polluted air and noise pollution from private motor vehicles jammed up on ever-more highways? Artificial islands for the wealthy? More theme parks (even on the eco-heritage site of Jerejak Island)? More and more malls selling stuff few can afford to buy? Home prices beyond the reach of the middle class and the lower-income group? More private hospitals and private schools charging exorbitant fees?

A concerned Penangite responded:

Backward? What is backward?

If backward means an incredible quality of life – the envy of the rest of the country – then we choose backward.

In fact we have always been among the most advanced – artists, writers, scholars, musicians, world class sportsmen and women. Think about who the best of Malaysia are and realise many of them are from Penang: P Ramlee, Jimmy Boyle, Lee Chong Wei, Nicol David, Chuah Thean Teng, Jimmy Choo, Dr Wu Lien-teh etc etc.

One small state with a world heritage site, a national park, a botanic garden, beach resorts, a hill resort, beach promenades, the cleanest water supply, one of the earliest electronic parks AND one of the strongest civil society sectors. People of Penang who actually care with no hidden agendas – you call us ‘backward’ and want to change all of it? To what? Let us know please.

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Heng GS
Heng GS
17 Nov 2018 9.24pm

Develop develop develop ….
Chow better develop Penang Lang right mindset with reading culture so develop digital libraries per your manifesto.
Chow want to wait for Sim, and Sim wait for Chow, no wonder BB Library not happening.
Enough shopping and makan developed, now go develop libraries for all.

Shriek
Shriek
18 Nov 2018 11.46am
Reply to  Heng GS

E library is all in the internet. No need to travel, use bas or car. Why Malaysia can’t produce tablet or cheap smart phone. Then cheap internet can read news 360 deg 7\11.

Ya Hui
Ya Hui
19 Nov 2018 1.36pm
Reply to  Shriek

You cannot empathise with old generation who is not internet savvy. Not easy to read from smartphone when your eyesight is deteriorating.

Maybe you could check with your father or grandfather if he has the same difficulty.

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 3.53pm
Reply to  Ya Hui

Why read when you can listen from internet. Newspaper can’t make sound. How many papers required? They take hours to finish reading. You want to wait for him?

tunglang
tunglang
20 Nov 2018 7.15pm
Reply to  Shriek

Why read or listen from internet when CAT Sin Chow allows additional noisy airport on Pg island which neuters both senses of older folks.
What’s your next fast spin? Braille reading???

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 10.29am
Reply to  tunglang

Ah pek now only wake up? I have been saying move the airport. But you too blind which i mentioned so many times and only now complained pg airport is noisy. U from peng land? You better start braille reading asap. No bad internet can’t tolong you.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 8.59pm
Reply to  tunglang

Spinner, you should tell the pH to stop tourist from coming and landing in pg airport. Many times telling ah pek to relocate the airport. Ah pek clear picture. Money face. Want more tourists to come and bring all the rmb, green backs or yen

Elvin Ang
Elvin Ang
19 Nov 2018 3.08pm
Reply to  Shriek

Unfortunately we are not like Singapore where old folks can utilise their yearly $500 training grant to learn to use tablet and surfing on internet. Here in Malaydia even HRDF has been abused!

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 5.09pm
Reply to  Elvin Ang

Then use 500 to buy newspaper and like pool car each take his hours to read. Think laterally. 7 persons one per week

George Kong
George Kong
18 Nov 2018 2.19pm
Reply to  Heng GS

Don’t deny old folks the library as they want to read newspapers foc. Take care of old folks who voted for PH. Young voters may swing to MCA since got lubang.

X Man
X Man
19 Nov 2018 3.31pm
Reply to  George Kong

RM1. 50 per newspaper per day. It is a financial burden for our senior citizens with no active income. So if PH government want to reach out to them, important that they get message from newspapers, not Internet or social media. Therefore it is a social obligation to provide newspapers and library for free reading. Not all senior citizens can afford smartphone or has the ability and desire to access the net for information. If PH cannot provide the library, perhaps Gerakan or MCA can sponsor one at Bayan Baru in order to win the hearts of the senior citizens… Read more »

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 10.31am
Reply to  X Man

Pool together. One buy each week and take one or one half hour to read. In library, some read papers as if it belongs to them. They read obituaries too?

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 3.57pm
Reply to  George Kong

Don’t deny the rakan muda and tidal sangat rakan muda. They want to surf the net, twit and instragam.
Tell sim if you all don’t mind having pasar malam or kopi tiam library.

Norman
Norman
21 Nov 2018 7.30am
Reply to  George Kong

Reading hardcopy newspapers is a ritual for many old folks, like having their comfort food. Why deny them such privilege at their twilight years?

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 10.45am
Reply to  Norman

Do you know how long they take to read and finish the paper?

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.06pm
Reply to  Norman

The library newspapers are for everyone. Since as mentioned they take their sweet time, then when can others take their turn to read. You want to wait in the library everyday to wait for your turn to read the papers? You maybe second or third person lining up. Peng lang never think and experience this because there is no library.

PenangLang
PenangLang
17 Nov 2018 10.51pm

Until there is opposition voice in the state DUNs, any talk is worthless. DAP can’t be bothered to layan you apeks as they know the younger generation will vote for them no matter what.

Wei
Wei
18 Nov 2018 10.57am
Reply to  PenangLang

hehe..of course, young people loves government that can create jobs and grow the economy…….they have their feets on the ground more so than the ever anti development apeks who have benefited and accumulated wealth over past years of development but now selfishly want development stop…

Shriek
Shriek
18 Nov 2018 11.43am
Reply to  PenangLang

Peng land is divided between ah peks and muda. Past drink water from pg hills now drink water from muda. When muda waterunder threat, pg forum hardly can be found.

Elvin Ang
Elvin Ang
19 Nov 2018 3.11pm
Reply to  Shriek

Ah Pek can bring their grandkids to library to pick up reading habits (provided library is available) instead of having the kids picking up bad GG habits at pusat hiburan keluarga, pk one another on Dota or that China Legend e-Sport wasting money and time.

Shriek
Shriek
20 Nov 2018 11.15am
Reply to  Elvin Ang

Ask tunglang what he did as billy the kids. Roam round peng land, catch spider, fly kites and spinning gasing and this make him today ad top spinner. Orso ask jimmy. Where got library during his time but today peng lang migrate and make themselves top class.

Penang 808 generation
Penang 808 generation
19 Nov 2018 10.43am
Reply to  PenangLang

Without Ah Peks, there are no youngsters playing Dota on Astro 808. Show some respect lah.

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 4.03pm

Without development there will be no astro. With development, we have radio, then b + w tv follow by colour tv. Orso show some respect.

IT.Scheiss
IT.Scheiss
20 Nov 2018 3.39am
Reply to  Shriek

I don’t have Astro, I smashed my TV and pulled the antenna down from the roof, I disconnected my HyppTV decoder, I very very rarely buy a newspaper and I don’t listen to radio and I’m very happy reading my news on the Internet and not from mainstream western news sources but from alternative sources in Malaysia and worldwide.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 6.17am
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

No development no internet no WiFi, no hand phone and no smart phone. Can only eat physical apple and no apple from Steve Jacob.

Norman
Norman
21 Nov 2018 7.35am
Reply to  Shriek

Do not be a slave to Astro.
Get an OTT TV box if you already have wifi at home.

https://m.facebook.com/EvpadTvboxMalaysiaAuthorizedDistributor/

Call Me Handsome
Call Me Handsome
22 Nov 2018 1.09pm
Reply to  Norman

OTT TV Box a threat to Astro whether on demand ir not. Now which politicians to venture i yo this biz to monopolise the market?

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 7.13pm

Now you talk about astro. Just to remind you without development there is no astro. Ask tunglang what time he went to bed when he is billy the kid? Why sudden population explosion? No radio no TV in short no other night entertainment. Then comes radio Malaya follow by TV Malaysia comes in colour. Black n white colour. Then true technical colour. So please show respect for development as we have internet. Soon will be 5G.

tunglang
tunglang
21 Nov 2018 12.18am
Reply to  Shriek

I listened to RAAF Radio @ Butterworth deejayed by youngsters from RAAF School in the 1980s. Bed time? Average 1-2am. Spoilt your false assumption shrieking, Dude!

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 10.52am
Reply to  tunglang

Lucky you. Family can afford radio using hot tubes and with RAAF nearby. Senior happy with just listening. Can’t see and read pun okay. No complain? Never think about the rest? Radios not chip chip and small like smart phone. Radio like TV display in the living room.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.14pm
Reply to  tunglang

In the 80s, RAAF is about to close shop and pulling out of peng land. Confrontation with Indonesia is long over where you used to practise in the air raid as mentioned by you. The indon confrontation was in the early 60s just after formation of Malaysia. Ah pek still catching spider. Ah pek real getting old foget 80s and 60s are 20 back. Hope not forget how to get back home.

tunglang
tunglang
19 Nov 2018 10.34pm

Cheers Kopi-O kau kau kau!

IT.Scheiss
IT.Scheiss
20 Nov 2018 3.26am
Reply to  PenangLang

The problem is that the opposition in the state DUN and parliament is the BN or whatever is left of it, unless you’re thinking of Gerakan, now out of the BN to make a comeback in GE15. Moreover, despite whatever criticism of Penang’s Pakatan state government, most Penang voters, especially on Penang island, are unlikely to want to vote BN or Gerakan for that matter. The Star of 19 November 2018 reported YB Chow as saying:- GEORGE TOWN: Non-governmen­tal organisations (NGOs) have beco­me more vocal towards the state’s development plans instead of the opposition, says Chow Kon Yeow. The Chief… Read more »

Shriek
Shriek
20 Nov 2018 11.22am
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

Vocal because of anti development. See the excuse of slope failure. Hk runs like a country and has billions to spend. They think of spending 500 billion hkd to reclaim. They oredi spend hundreds of billions on high speed terminal, HK to China bridge and shatin to central rail. If you ate smart, tell us how much peng land gomen has in the kitty? Billions, hundred of millions or couple of millions?

Penang1
Penang1
20 Nov 2018 1.51pm
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

Civil society oppose because of principle and belief. Political parties oppose because it is a vote winning opportunity. One has only to look at both the DAP and Gerakan to see this fact. So the people has to play the political parties to achieve their objectives. Unfortunately for us there is only one party left standing in Penang.

IT.Scheiss
IT.Scheiss
21 Nov 2018 7.54am
Reply to  Penang1

True, and that is why the only opposition left is civil society, though the government will allow civil society to speak up and protest peacefully, then ignore us and carry on with their business as usual.

It’s frustrating no doubt but I guess we just have to carry on.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 10.54am
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

NGO can say anything and everything. But cannot do anything and everything. Ask them to become political party?

tunglang
tunglang
17 Nov 2018 7.28pm

One word for CAT Sin Chow – Irresponsible.
Previously the head of Pg CAT, Niao Kong – Arrogant.
From arrogant to irresponsible, that’s the perangai tak siuman since the 308 euphoria for UBAH.
Recently, we already experienced Cash Is King maleficence.
Now we are living thro’ Already Developed Not Enough!

CAT Sin Chow must better Niao Kong?

Elvin Ang
Elvin Ang
19 Nov 2018 3.18pm
Reply to  tunglang

Chow has poker face, he does not reveal to you his inner feelings.

PenangLang
PenangLang
18 Nov 2018 1.01pm

I’d rather go for the Nordic countries route where people are happiest and environmental concern rules. Our No 1 developer spokesman naturally is infactuated with the developers (or maybe their political contributions?). Why not follow China, the property developer heaven, just build build build….until the bubble eventually burst.

tunglang
tunglang
18 Nov 2018 5.34pm
Reply to  PenangLang

Property & infrastructure development is very DANGEROUS esp. on slippery & unstable hill slopes where the authorities concerned have no real expertise + enough manpower to daily monitor, control & take effective counter measures when there are signs of an imminent disaster. And irresponsibly defiant to allow such DANGEROUS recalcitrance to continue. Nobody wants this kind of DANGEROUS development where lives are at stake, during construction & post construction in-use. To say older folks & NGOs don’t want development is a LIAR-SPIN to discredit + distract from the legit safety concerns so as to cover up the indisputable DANGEROUS activities… Read more »

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 4.07pm
Reply to  tunglang

Engineer says can. Who are you? Engineer? Space craft orso dangerous but through experience, it is less dangerous than driving.

Rodney Fong
Rodney Fong
19 Nov 2018 1.18am

Why must everything stop because there was a land slide. Do you not think we should determine the actual fault and punish the wrong doers. Is it not better than punish the entire people of Penang by scrapping PTMP. Why make the People of Penang suffer because of someone’s error in discharging his duty that has caused the mud slide. Since landslides do happen everywhere in many other countries all over the world. It’s how we can best rectify the work. Not stop the whole project. Hong Kong was mention merely to show that we can also learn from our… Read more »

Wei
Wei
19 Nov 2018 9.27am
Reply to  Anil Netto

so Anil want to make more people travel from Mainland to Island. Anil must be thinking the Penang bridge is under utilised and not enough carbon in the air now…..hehe

Elvin Ang
Elvin Ang
19 Nov 2018 3.13pm
Reply to  Anil Netto

Ferry service lacks demand because Penang motorists want to be behind steering wheels stepping on accelerator at all time on the road or bridge, not idle with car engine shut down onboard the ferry!

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.22pm
Reply to  Anil Netto

Same with public buses. Tunglang complain he has to wait almost hour for bus to come. People wants personal freedom to have cars including pg forummers. If 23,000 who sign the petition take buses and this means about 10,000 cars are off the road. Yet pg forum boast of 23k signing but not taking public transport. Imagine how much drop in world temperature if the 23k is not using cars.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 6.25am
Reply to  Anil Netto

Spend so much money but the passenger load is still tidak laku. Malaysia and peng land is not loaded. Money may as well spend on libraries.
PF should not just talk and talk to oppose. I know very green overseas group organised workshop and paid by councils. They really encourage sustainability such as using solar panels, bicycle rides and worm farms and composit using kitchen waste to turn to organic fertilizers.
Easy to talk but not do.

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 7.16pm
Reply to  Anil Netto

Pg forum thinks of only one type of road and they are all the same. Go and ask the pHD student. There is a hierarchy in the road system like a tree.

thelandlord
thelandlord
18 Nov 2018 12.57pm

i think it’s high time for (others) to be CM. … CM will (allegedly) ALWAYS stick up for 1% … DEVELOPERS to the detriment of the 99% of the people. Click to Edit –  <p>i think it&#8217;s high time for (others) to be CM. … CM will ALWAYS stick up for 1% … DEVELOPERS to the detriment of the 99% of the people.</p> SaveCancelDelete Click to Edit –  <div id="sce-comment246190" class="sce-comment"><p>i think it&#8217;s high time for (others) to be CM. &#8230; CM will (allegedly) ALWAYS stick up for 1% &#8230; DEVELOPERS to the detriment of the 99% of the people.</p> </div><div id="sce-edit-comment246190"… Read more »

Heng GS
Heng GS
18 Nov 2018 11.57am

In the 70s when Hong Kong was a bit messy, the B40 there find solace in the songs of Samuel Hui, who till now still inspires many also in Penang with reflective lyrics and melodious songs.
How can Penang still in denial mode able to stand up with choking traffic comes to term with reality, will there a new breed of creative voices in local music and literature to guide the lost souls on island????

Norman
Norman
19 Nov 2018 4.57pm
Reply to  Heng GS

Samuel Hui has ‘farewell concert’ in Malaysia every year, just like Air Supply and MLTR. Just like some shops repeatedly having closing down sales but remain in operation indefinitely.

This year Samuel Hui even tag team Alan Tam to squeeze Ringgit from Malaysians in a joint concert in Genting.

Malaysian chinese audience are not willing to pay for local artists’ performance, but would q 4 nights for Jacky Cheung or Twice K-pop concert tickets.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.26pm
Reply to  Norman

That is why is called canto pop. Until now any peng pop? The hokkien in peng will not understand by hokkien in xiamen, quanzhou or those in Taiwan.

Norman
Norman
18 Nov 2018 3.57pm
Elvin Ang
Elvin Ang
19 Nov 2018 3.17pm
Reply to  Norman

A number of second or third generation Penang hawkers have migrated south to operate in Singapore. Singaporeans can now sample authentic Penang hawker fare without travelling out of their country. Suntec City in Singapore has a Penang Place restaurant, with Chinese cooks from Penang as the boss is a former Penangite.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 6.30am
Reply to  Elvin Ang

Ask why very green wants to migrate to concrete with very high rise, traffic and highways?

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 4.10pm
Reply to  Norman

Many food in singland are from Malaysia. Like bah kut teh.

Norman
Norman
18 Nov 2018 11.23am

Ignoring MCA/MIC, Umno president Ahmad Zahid Hamidi openly called for a PAS-Umno merger at a rally organised by the two parties.

“Dear (PAS president) Abdul Hadi Awang, God willing, under my leadership, let us bercantum (merge)” Zahid melamar Hadi.

https://m.malaysiakini.com/news/452371

Richard Liew
17 Nov 2018 9.37pm

Sad to say Penang is no Hong Kong.

Shriek
Shriek
18 Nov 2018 11.50am
Reply to  Richard Liew

Malaysia no china Or uncle Sam. Takes time and get experience.

IT.Scheiss
IT.Scheiss
20 Nov 2018 3.07am

I posed three questions to YB Chow in a post on my Politischeiss blog. WHAT HAS PENANG LEARNED FROM HONG KONG, Y.B. CHOW KON YEOW? 1. You say that Hong Kong learned from its landslide tragedy in the 1970s, with studies which have developed means to avoid future landslides. My question then is what has Penang learned from Hong Kong’s studies and measures which could have been applied to hill slope development in Penang, taking into consideration similarities and differences between hill slope geology, soil structure, soil stability, rainfall volume, risk from earthquakes and so forth of hills in Penang… Read more »

John Tan
19 Nov 2018 10.03am

On the contrary… Glad Penang is no HK! And let’s keep it that way!

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 4.14pm
Reply to  John Tan

Then don’t have airport and convention centre. Peng land will not have jimmy Choo. Too bad, many peng land they migrate to kl, sing land and all over the world. They want to speak more then peng land hokkien kau beh kau bu.

IT.Scheiss
IT.Scheiss
20 Nov 2018 3.34am
Reply to  John Tan

The problem is that Penang’s CAT government will make Penang look like Hong Kong with a concrete jungle, minus all the other achievements of human talent and ingenuity.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 10.58am
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

Problem with people living near the border with LOS wants to live in concrete jungle. They lost the smile in when they live near the border.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.32pm
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

Where did most peng land talent goes? Jimmy, ramlee etc stay put in peng land? Their livelihood demands them to be out of peng land most of the time. Even sportsmen had to go outside of peng land to play. If not become kg jaguh.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.47pm
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

Problem is with people like you in stay near the border with LOS and move to Subang. Rubber trees have to be cleared and houses and offices built when you come to subang

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.51pm
Reply to  IT.Scheiss

Easy to build Penang bridge? No need talent? Prof Chin, first dean of um engineering faculty play a major role. Now which dean is doing it under umno?

Penang1
Penang1
20 Nov 2018 1.56pm
Reply to  John Tan

Or Singapore. Advance Nordic countries are the best example to emulate. They have achieved balance in their development while China is the worst example, where they have destroyed their environment in the name of development.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.37pm
Reply to  Penang1

Blame on Deng and you can tell him that overseas Chinese can still send money to their chinese relatives. Chinese will be still behind the bamboo curtain with 650 million in poverty.

Lemmy
Lemmy
18 Nov 2018 1.15pm

Same issue repeated many times and always get same replies. Tired already.

Ijoe
17 Nov 2018 11.23pm

Yeah but without HK’d expertise.

Wei
Wei
18 Nov 2018 11.20am

why do the government need to listen to the NGOs ? not until when the NGOs stop using their own car cruising on the highway ,road that they so loathe , stop staying in houses ,condominium that displace greenery, stop flying in and out from the airport that bring in more traffic more development……..WALK THE TALK, not TALK THE COCK lar lim gang….hehe

cross
cross
18 Nov 2018 4.08pm
Reply to  Wei

Yeah, Penang forum wants sustainable development, so ask them … don’t breed. Sounds rude but yeah, they deserve it.

Penang1
Penang1
19 Nov 2018 6.57am
Reply to  Wei

You’re right. We should only listen to the property developers and ‘sincere’ politicians who has the interest of Penang people at heart only. Greedy NGOs are only interested in making lots and lots of money.

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 7.21pm
Reply to  Penang1

Ask tunglang. He can move out of his condo and stay in his billy the kids days in Wong hei Hoong style heritage shop house if he is not happy with developers. By the way, how come heritage shop houses come in rows, similar in look and style? But be build by peng land ancestor developers. Lucky otherwise no UNESCO status.

tunglang
tunglang
21 Nov 2018 12.22am
Reply to  Shriek

You think I am so free to answer your shrieking nonsense ah?

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 9.40pm
Reply to  tunglang

You are ashamed to answer my shrieking question and giving excuses. Too many spinning and now exposed.

Ma jiji
Ma jiji
18 Nov 2018 11.52am

Ah, how about a sidekick-reverb kind of news: 香港特首爱上槟城 ?
http://www.enanyang.my/news/20181118/%e9%a6%99%e6%b8%af%e7%89%b9%e9%a6%96%e7%88%b1%e4%b8%8a%e6%a7%9f%e5%9f%8e/

Even that strong lady at the helm love Penang !?

Wei
Wei
18 Nov 2018 10.44am

nothing wrong with HK style development where commerce thrive, wealth created and human potential realized….hehehe

Shriek
Shriek
18 Nov 2018 11.48am
Reply to  Wei

Hk gomen built tracks across the 7 hills. Many will go and hike to get a better view.

PenangLang
PenangLang
18 Nov 2018 2.43pm
Reply to  Wei

Brother, are you blind? Can you see the picture above? These RBAs are happy as they get their paycheck from Komtar while neglecting the disastrous environmental damage that this goverment is doing.

tunglang
tunglang
18 Nov 2018 4.40pm
Reply to  PenangLang

He is not only blind, he is also mad.
Don’t you see the hehehe? And he exceedingly loves to … kill forests, hills … & God knows what else!

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 7.29pm
Reply to  tunglang

Mad? Then no crime committed. You will be sentenced at expense of life. But then lucky, now life imprisoned.

Shriek
Shriek
21 Nov 2018 11.10am
Reply to  tunglang

Mad. Good. Judge says commit no crime and no sin. But you very sinful and premeditate.

Shriek
Shriek
19 Nov 2018 7.27pm
Reply to  PenangLang

Now talk and without thinking like dumno. Calling everyone rbas and until no evidence. Tell people off when they work as setting tables by roadside. Want people to gorek like dumno…