Bloggers launch “Penangites for Trams” campaign
Today, several Penang-based bloggers and websites simultaneously launched a “Penangites for Trams” campaign.
We hope more and more bloggers and webmasters - especially all those who care for Penang - will join in the campaign by placing these graphics on their blogs or websites. You may link the graphic to the URL for this post or choose to link to any other article or post extolling the benefits of trams. Leave a comment here and you will then be added to the list below of blogs/websites supporting the campaign.
This will help to raise awareness of the viability and economic benefits of trams. Of course, trams work best as part of an integrated public transport system, complementing an efficient and extensive network of buses.
Fittingly, the latest issue of business weekly The Edge carries a full-page article in support of the re-introduction of trams in Penang.
Join in the campaign and pass the word around.
So far, these are the bloggers and websites that support the re-introduction of trams in Penang:
- Mustafa K Anuar
- Susan Loone
- Mucked in a Jam
- Penang Watch
- Kris Khaira
- Surind
- Anything Goes
- LAH-mour
- No Kacau and Don’t Kacau
- Stephen Doss
- Contemporary Malaysia
- Black and White (Justin Choo)
- The Kuala Lumpur Traveller
- Forest Explorers
- Apprize
- News for Malaysians
- Wartawan Rasmi Laman Reformasi
- DanielYKL
- Lucia Lai
- I am a Malaysian
- Carol and Jeffrey’s Big View of the World
- Lestari Heritage Network
- Motivation in Motion
- World Messenger
- Brand Bounce
- Sources of Life
- Maaran Matters
- Messy Christian
- Sivin Kit’s Garden
- u-jean
- Fair is what fair wants
- BalikPulau.org
- Sally Knits
- anilnetto.com
Come on, together we can bring the trams back to Penang!
In case you are wondering what advantages trams bring, here’s a list from the City of Edinburgh Council website.
The number of residents, visitors and businesses are expanding, especially in key areas such as the Waterfront and west Edinburgh.
While growth is good for our economy, it also means our roads will get busier and journeys longer without a new transport choice. Trams can carry large numbers of people quickly and efficiently.
Trams don’t take up a lot of road space but they do carry a lot of people. As Edinburgh continues to grow, trams will be the most efficient way for people to travel about our city.
- Trams show a city is a modern and well-connected place to do business which can lead to more investment, new jobs, regeneration and more prosperity for us all
- Trams are an attractive option for motorists, with car users likely to be attracted to tram travel. Research shows 20% of peak hour and 50% of weekend tram passengers in the UK previously travelled by car
- Trams enhance the urban environment and generate civic pride
- Trams will encourage shoppers to travel to the city centre which can lead to more investment by businesses and regeneration. Dublin saw a rise of between 20% - 50% in pedestrian footfall figures on Grafton Street, the city’s main shopping thoroughfare. Some retailers reported a 25% increase in trade
- Residential and commercial properties may see prices increase beside tram routes. In some cities with trams, house prices have risen by up to 15% and rental prices by up to 7%
- As trams run on electricity, there will be no emissions from the vehicles themselves
- Trams will be accessible to everyone, with benefits of low level boardings at every stop and other easy-to-use features which particularly help the disabled and less mobile
- Trams will be safe to use as, in addition to a driver, every tram will have a passenger attendant on board to check tickets, answer passenger queries and ensure no anti-social behaviour occurs
- Trams will offer concessionary fares
- Blogger Power drives Penangites for Trams Campaign
- Time to bring back the trams
- Why spend only RM4 million on trams when you can spend billions on mega projects
- Old tram railtrack unearthed along Penang Road
- 85% of motorists ready to switch to buses and trams
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Mr.anil,
MY sincere salute for you.
You follow up,critised by some but stay focus and now the seeds in your minds slowly growing in others blogs.
Hope your pet project will take off and become like a “bayan tree” for the people you fighting for.
I hope there will be many blogs owner will be focus as you and get the public support.
Raj raman666.not the devil999
Why invest in trams when there are a lot of room for more development and improvement in buses, especially in Penang where we don’t even have any integrated public transportation system at all. In my personal opinion only when the benefit and the capacity of buses are fully tapped and capitalised should we be looking into trams.
And include double-decker buses - reduces no. of buses & moves more people, more economical and is a favourite among children & tourists.
Go for it! Trams will run a “more organized” route and schedule - something the “Rabbit Penang” can’t seem to do! It’ll also make Penang look more like a tourist destination - what’s more it can be turned into a “Projek Rakyat” where the investment could come from Penangites with a body of professional no-nonsense (CAT) management running and turning out social and monetary profits to be shared among Penangites! In that case, whether there’ll be a fast or slow change in the Federal Government does not matter! If we make make world cup football live telecast a reality with the people’s “investment”, certainly a more meaningful “tram project” will receive more support!
Trams are slow and can be delayed by traffic jams. Imagine there are thousands of motorcycles and they are Mat Rempits trying to show off and cut across the tram lines. Also there are many traffic junctions which can delay the trvel time. Ask ourself, how long should a journey last? If at normal speed, it is half hour but with jam, will it take 1 hour? Imagine standing for 1 hour. Still prefer monorail. At least we have a view to look down or at the shophouse and for sure, the monorail can go according to the time table as it stop and pick up passengers. whereas trams cannot follow the time-table. No wonder in Malaysia, we have rubber time.
Would someone _please_ put on their brain before they start talking about putting trams on the road in Penang?
Wanna make Penang better, please go for it. But please, stop making STOOOOPID suggestions that will only make Penang a ridiculous place to be.
Thank you very much !!
Penangites for Trams! Totally! To revitalize the city you need to increase human density without increasing numbers of cars and heat-generating car parks. The only answer is public transport, good, clean and cheap to run. It’s the first step towards a eco-sensible direction and a liveable future for Penang.
Yeah!! I love trams!! Bring them, PJ needs them too!
[...] several Penang-based bloggers had launched a campaign to bring back trams to Penang. So here is The Kuala Lumpur Traveler’s support for Penangites for Trams [...]
Kick back payment to UMNO politicians is based on total amount spent on a project. The formula is simple, more we spent, then more kick back they get.
Smaller budget tram project does not look good for UMNO cronies.
Comment by jughead | Wednesday, 14 May 2008
Would someone _please_ put on their brain before they start talking about putting trams on the road in Penang?
Wanna make Penang better, please go for it. But please, stop making STOOOOPID suggestions that will only make Penang a ridiculous place to be.
Thank you very much !!
===
Hong Kong’s tram is working smoothly adter 100 years of service and tram is considered an effiective mode of transport.
Before calling other stupid, take a mirror to see your own ugly face first.
[...] by Anil Netto, who has a little write up of the benefits of trams in his blog, the campaign is expected to [...]
Improve the “bus system” before looking into trams??? and how do you propose we do that…from MPPP bus to rapid Penang…has things changed? The looks of the bus have changed but the system still sucks! C’mon, sometimes you just can’t patch up an old shirt using new cloth… Other countries have proven that tram system is a much efficient and cleaner system than buses. Why not subways? LRT? MRT? Well, if money is not a problem, why not? But as you know, global recession is looming and “water tap” has been shut off by the Federal government since 308…and we definitely need to do something to plan for the future with something within our means…just talking or should I say dreaming about a better bus system isn’t going to help…We need something practical and workable…also if the project is small enough to ward off those cronies and vultures who are only interested in big money, then we can be sure that the money spent will be on the tram project and not into somebody’s pocket! Go for it…for a better and cleaner transport system…Penang will lead the way!!
mr.anil,
still majority support you althou some comments become very personal.
goooo for it.Penang need some kind of tourist attraction.If mat rempits wants to show off and die let its be.The ferries also should remain with some upgrading.
Loose some but always gain some,tourist money i believe second largest investment.with economies slow down and uncertain federal funding,Penang need to atrract more tourist.
Your pet project wont cost much,hope the chief minister can look into it.No harm to invest a bit,if other countries can do it why Penang cannot.(your statistic does show some points there)
Rajraman666.Love anything classic and enjoy the human factor.
[...] give it a thought - for the sake of the environment and better traffic system. Check Anil Netto for details of the ‘Penangites for Trams’ [...]
I go for monorail and tram system that is well integrated together.. each completes the other… learn from KL (do not repeat) where monorail, Star and Putra LRT did not integrate together….
Ever since i was a kid and my dad used to tell me that there were such things called Trams in Penang in the early 1920s, i always used to wonder how Penang looked like when Trams wandered the streets. Now this dream is about to become a reality.
Now do not get me wrong. It is not only because i want to see how a Tram would look like in PG but ever since i realised what a Tram was, I did my research and found out how cost efficient, and nature friendly they were.
Every time i traveled and saw a Tram it would make me feel so exited and i would take loads of pictures, here are some of my personal “stash” on Trams. There are more pictures but i think this will do to give you a gist on what Trams are.
[IMG]http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll303/vixstarr/DSC00832.jpg[/IMG]
Here is a Tram line in Manchester, England
[IMG]http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll303/vixstarr/DSC00840.jpg[/IMG]
Here is a Tram in Manchester, England
[IMG]http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll303/vixstarr/DSC02614.jpg[/IMG]
Here is a Tram and Tram line in Bydgoszcz, Poland
[IMG]http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll303/vixstarr/DSC02615.jpg[/IMG]
Here is a Tram in Bydgoszcz, Poland
[IMG]http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll303/vixstarr/DSC02615.jpg[/IMG]
Trams, good idea but the potential of current public transports should be exploited to its fullest.
Current Bus service is appalling, uncomfortable conditions and irregular schedules just to name a few. the taxi? well, how many penangites use taxi? why?
improve the bus service, bring cleaner, more n newer buses, retrain all drivers and conductors to be more professional and be pride in what they do. Have dedicated bus lanes and just make it more appealing in general.
Trams are only good within the city and shopping districts but wont solve the traffic problem.
Public transportation should never be privatised.
Wednesday, April 16, 2008
TRAMS?
Anil Netto’s article on TRAMS; that could replace monorail in Penang is interesting. Some of its highlights are as follows;
>“Trams are pollution-free and are being used in cities with narrow roads
> Estimated that less than RM3.8mil (US$1mil) was needed to get an electrical tram system up and running in George Town.
>Old tramlines such as from Prangin Mall to Weld Quay still exists underneath the bitumen road and can be restored for use,” he said. A 50m tramline was unearthed at the Chulia Street-Penang Road junction in 2004 during road works and was preserved by the Penang Municipal Council.
>There are many second- hand trams in other countries that are for purchase.”
>Existing street poles could be used to support the one-cable electrical wiring for trams, he added
See http://anilnetto.com/ for details
May 14th:
THANKS ANIL.
getting trams back on the penang street is a good campaign but i think before that an indepth study need to be done - is it really possible, seeing that our penang roads are now so congested? i am all for trams in penang but there need to be capable competent people involved in the project and running it.
ok one day when i’m free i’ll put up the penangites for trams banner up in my blog. i’ll link it to the post where ric francis (the aussie rail expert, and a friend of mine) came to give a talk on trams in penang.
san francisco had it, why not penang ? rushers won’t need it but penangites prefer it,the mat rempits were umno bred so ‘f’ them off ! what are the police for ? go ahead penangites give full support for trams and also a few important route for monorails will do ! come on penangites show your support
Anil
Congratulations to you and the others on your initiative.
You have the support of the Kelana Jaya People’s Parliament group (http://groups.google.com/group/kjaya_parliament?hl=en)
Some people may disagree with the value of trams on the roads, but I dont think that is the point.
The point is, we need to be able to look at alternatives beyond the traditional solutions (LRT, Monorail, or more cars).
Trams may or may not be a solution for Penang’s public transport issues. However, it is our responsibility to look at all the solutions before we make any decision.
Good luck, and please contact me at transportkini@gmail.com for further discussion of your proposal.
mya
As a Penangite I would like to wholeheartedly support this initiative. Hope the DAP will act fast on this, hopefully before its too late
p.s I have put on record in my blog to support this initiative .
At first I was cool with idea with trams, but I recently did a paper on BRT - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bus_rapid_transit (check the sources for statistics valdiation its still wikipedia:) vs LRT because where I live in the San Fernando Valley of LA theres been a debate where people are now saying it should have been a light rail instead because of the vast distances people commute.
Penang, does not need trams for a transportation solution, and monorail is the worst of them all. Firstly, to show need, the bus use must be maximized first for justification. Penang has very space but subways would be too expensive. The in-between compromise would be a dedicated, right-of-way bus transit (BRT,that somewhat works like rail).
There is no one way solution, and most metro’s a ‘multi-modal’ approach. A subway for georgetown cbd, lrt for the peripheries, feeder busses to supply this main rail artery, but DONT buy into the monorail lie. Once its built theres no turning back and future generations have to pay. Itll be a white elephant- look at the kl lrt which is a joke for people to RELY ON TO GIVE UP THE CAR. Its great for looks and tourists but not a solution at all, and trams are included(unless city of edinburgh says its made for speed)
Hi Anil,
This will my third and last attempt to post my comment. The earlier two did not appear.
I also support the Penangites for Tram programme @ my new blog: http://blackandwhite999.blogspot.com/
Come to think of it, maybe the trolley buses would be a better option. What is your opinion?
J Choo
Bro Anil
U r Doing a good job, something nice to bring back trams, well Trams will be transportation & tourism attraction. Waiting to take a ride soon. My dream will come thru ha?
Bro Anil; Why la they cancel the Penang Bridge Run, I know you know. May be should get to the root cause of it & give the public some opening. boleh ke?
tks & God bless.
We should not wait for upgrade and improvement in the services provided by buses before implementing tams. The presence of Air Asia has enabled MAS to lower fares even when fuel costs escalated. Let the proper management of trams teach the bus operators what to do! Therefore, proper management is very important to ensure success!
Mr. Anil, is very good idea from you to re-introduce the trams back to Penang.
You certainly got my support for the trams proposal.
Beside that, this article already been posted up in my blog (http://dontkacau.blogspot.com/).
Hope to see more progress in this proposal, looking forward to see trams back in Penang.
While the idea of trams sounds good, judging from observations in Melbourne, Sydney and now in Zurich, having it in Penang somewhat poses a challenge as there are many factors for consideration including, but not limited to, road behaviour of motorists and pedestrians, planning, training of personnel, integration with rail / bus / ports - both sea and air, maintenance, quality of trams, tariff and real estate / tracking / acquisition of road / land. It has worked for ages for example here in Zurich because of all of the above factors, and quite possibly more.
Hey Jughead, you seem to be the only one making sense around here — me, i think like you also. Monorail good for Penang. Why you all don’t like monorail ah?
37 km Penang monorail is expected to cost 1.6 billion!! This project was (allegedly) awarded to PM’s son without open tender.
I am very sure inflated cost involved to oil UMNO politicians’ hand.
If someone can come out a chepaer and better alternative to solve traffic congestion in Penang island with let say 500 millions budget, why we taxpayers shall object any alternative project like tram and bus integrated service.
Trams are a good idea if they solve the rampant parking on all roads in Penang first. Get the police to clear out illegal parking. Then only do you think about trams.
To solve one problem, you have to look at other problems first. If the police and council do their jobs in clearing rampant parking, then traffic flow will be totally controlled by the traffic lights. Then again, roads in Penang have become too narrow to clear all the cars at each traffic light cos’ there are bottle necks right after each traffic light. 30 years ago, there weren’t as many cars. Then Proton came and many people now own cars. This is because the public transport in Penang were so bad under Koh Tsu Khoon’s tenure. People like him had no foresight in the future of the state. So, with more cars, roads became congested. Maybe he had a directive from someone to screw up the transport system so Proton could sell more cars.
Anyway, monorail is just an expensive bus system that won’t last. An underground MRT would be the answer that will cope with the population for the next 300 years. Yes, it will cost a bomb, but then our Federal Govt. always spends billions in building the tallest building, sending just 1 man to space, ….etc, just to either get into the Guiness Book of World Records, or just to show the Malaysia Boleh. The amount of money Malaysia spends on these crap could solve our poverty problems for a whole generation!
Our neighbour, Singapore, doesn’t have this attitude. They are so small, yet the money spent has totally benefited the people. And even Hong Kong, where they have one of the best transport systems in the world, and people there won’t need to buy a car. They built future proof transport systems. Can’t say that about Penang, though.
So before thinking that trams will solve the transport problems in the city, think ahead about what other problems we may have to solve first.
Oh, don’t think about getting the Federal Govt to send a whole team for 6 months to Germany to learn about public transport design. What they learnt and what they designed here are two different things!
Hi Anil
Good Project
On Transport needs of Penang, I have the following to share with you.
A] Recently I was in Penang with my family and had difficulty in locating the ferry terminal after paying the toll at Juru. I had to stop a couple of times to get directions as I did not want to use the bridge. Attention should be given to proper and adequate signage to reach the ferry terminal.
B] Introduce the use of articulate buses and reintroduce the Tram services once Penang had.
It is definite cheaper than the overhead Monorail or Subway Monorail. I have done a search on the net and am enclosing some of the sites that I found to be informative and self explanatory. The new models of Trams can be powered by electric or Hybrid engines such as Diesel or NGV.
Articulate Buses
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Articulated_bus
http://www.photo-transport.co.uk/buses/artic-conquest/artic-conquest.htm
http://www.ltd.org/search/showresult.html?versionthread=91a9a11313910620861b5f2c1d51daff
http://www.nrel.gov/vehiclesandfuels fleetest/pdfs/40585.pdf
Street cars on single rail guide
http://www.villagetechnology.com/buses.html
Streetcars or Trams
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tramcars
http://washington.bizjournals.com/washington/stories/2007/11/26/story10.html
http://www.skoda.cz/skoda-transportation/products/tramcars/tramcar-skoda-13-t-aid1880.html
http://www.huawei.com/publications/view.do?id=2893&cid=5269&pid=127
http://www.euronet.nl/~wijzer/elders.htm
http://www.apta.com/research/info/online/weyrich.cfm
http://www.heritagetrolley.org/artcileBringBackStreetcars3.htm
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-01-08-streetcars_x.htm
http://www.connectaustin.org/benefits_of.php
http://www.calcuttatramways.com/history.htm
http://www.globalphotos.org/hk-tram02.htm
http://www.hktramways.com/en/company/index.html
http://www.railway-technology.com/projects/turin/
http://www.kolkatabeckons.com/tramcar.html
http://www.koncar.com/novost.asp?nov_id=312
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester_Metrolink
http://www.cabq.gov/transit/modernstreetcar.html
http://www.pragoimex.cz/en/o.php?o=products
http://www.1kfriends.org/Transportation/WI_Transportation_Projects_/Streetcars.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trams_in_Melbourne
http://www.answers.com/topic/tram-2
http://www.metromonorail.com.au/extensionupdate.asp
http://www.pyongyang-metro.com/metrotrams.html
http://en.beijing2008.cn/32/80/article214078032.shtml
http://www.proaktiva.ch/tram/index.html
Info on Penang’s Tram services 1880 to 1963.
http://www.arecabooks.com/webpages/press01.html
http://www.arecabooks.com/webpages/books08c.html
http://www.arecabooks.com/webpages/books08h.html
http://anilnetto.com/category/public-transport/
http://penangwatch.net/taxonomy/term/6
Thank you and hope the above information will be useful to solve the transport woes in Penang. If the 2nd Bridge is a reality it should incorporate the Tram or at least a sky train [it will not hinder traffic movement on the bridge] to link the mainland and the island. The cost can be offset by cancelling the sightseeing deck in the centre of the bridge.
Thank you
With warmest regards
Sunny
My take? In all honesty, i think it will be a great project with very good and sensible intentions. However, before the trams could happen, i think that there’s a lot more that needs to be worked on, i.e. revamping the public transportation system in Penang.
Let’s take Perth for example. Though trams system doesn’t exist there, they’ve what they call the CAT bus system. Basically, these CAT buses provide free transportation within City and Fremantle (tourist attraction). In the city, CAT runs on 3 routes (and i’m not too sure how many routes in Freo) connecting every part of the city. Because of CATS, there’s hardly any traffic congestion in the city nor Freo.
And you probably might think that one needs to drive to the city and park their cars in the parking blocks before they can hop onto CAT. And if they do, why don’t they just drive to their desired destination? Well, the Perthians do… but not all. Mainly because petrol price is sky high (mind you, their petrol is NOT subsidised by the g’ment) and there’s very limited parking spaces in town, not to mention it’s expensive too. So. the Perthians join their rakyat hopping onto one of those suburb buses and/or trains connecting to the city. And in order for these systems to integrate well, buses and trains come on time, there are ample buses and trains on stand-by, and drivers are considerate and ethical.
Hence, my take on trams for Penangites is that revamping the system is most vital before anyone plants another white elephant in the middle of the road. Let’s hope that the new CM will have better foresight than the previous one
Anil congrats in being the impetus for some self organization happening. The issue here should not be which type of public transportation as everyone (and their grandmother) has an opinion.
The way to do this is to get the expert that has been most sucessful in implementing a cost effective and efficient system.
No one can claim this better than Jaimie Lerner the ex-Mayor of Curitiba and the ex-governer of Parana. A trained Architect from one of the more environmentally conscious schools (UC Berkeley) and a person of enomous energy, foresight and resourcefulness. He has made Curitiba the only city in the world that has achieved the 60’s dream of an environmental city. He consults with all the largest cities in the world (New York and Shanghai) and also the more recent sucessful example of Bogota, Colombia.
He is famed for his bi-articulated buses but his city also has trams. The strategy should be to shift the debate from the type of public transportation system to getting the public/civil society to be educated and organized and push for the hiring of a truest and tried expert which no government can argue against and then to implement it quickly once the will of the people has been organized.
The elite of our country sit on the boards of IJMs, Peroduas and Scomis are only interested in creating more roads to sell cars or create defunct public transportation systems (monorail).
A bus and tram combination similar to the one in Curitiba is an affront to the elite and thus the logic of the plan and implementer has to be of the highest order.
Many moons ago I had invited Lucien Kroll (another green Architect) to publish his write up in the Star, the article can be viewed here :
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3575/is_1227_205/ai_54956126
Good Luck and I await the day I don’t get stuck in traffic in Jelutong
Ken Yeh
Hi, Anil,
Another problem,regard the Black and White (Justine Choo),
He is Justin, not Justine (which is she):))
Hi, Anil,
Stephen Doss hyperlink is not correct.
Here the correct address:
[url]http://stephendoss.blogspot.com/2008/05/penangites-for-trams.html[/url]
Trams are only good in short distance or a sort of tourist attraction for Ulu Malaysians. If Trams are really good, why San Franco and HK do not build more trams? HK trams run a short distance from Sau Kei Wan to Central.
Trams also have to share the road with many road users like dogs, cats, pedestrians, cyclist, motorcyclists and vehicles. Imagine, there are many traffic lights, and road users trying to cross the road and tram lines. As a result, trams are really slow and if regular users will give and go back to cars or motorcycles. If there is an accident in the morning, all the trams in that line cannot move until it is clear. So good on you that you can have the morning w/o going to work.
Also you may think it is cheap. No, you have to dig up the road laid with water, electricity and internet cables all over the road in Penang. Imagine, the traffic jam in the CBD while the existing road is dug for the tracks.
Whereas for the monorail, we can be sure that there will not be any traffic jam and it is a dedicated line - no other sharer except for passengers who already prepay and just waiting to hop in and off. Whereas, trams can be delayed there are passengers digging for the coins or last minute runners trying to flag down the tram.
So system is cheap. But to be a serious transport system that draws riders instead of losing patrons, it must be efficient and running on time and will not be delayed. If there is a system that does that I will give up my motorcycle which beat jams and parking.
So be practical rather than base on novelty or just to attract tourist rather than sitting in the tram caused by traffic jams. Even Melbourne has not been building more tram lines.
Yes. We need Trams - cheap, efficient and a great tourist attraction. I have this “Penangites for Trams” campaign in my blog.
Before asking experts to revamp our public transport system, let’s get the public involved in the planning of it. Some of the previous government of Penang never knew what the daily commuter goes through each day. They only assume what we go through and normally make no changes based on their assumptions. They just say, ” Looks ok mah!”. They should try waiting for a bus or taxi like the rest of us, then go back and think hard.
Or try driving to and from work each day like everyone else at peak hours. That will give them insight to what we go through everyday. Bumpy roads, bad drivers, slow drivers, cars parked in no parking zones, etc.
This is typical of the Penang driving attitude. Inconsiderate drivers, who will just keep the car running while waiting for someone. Just go to Beach Street and experience the amount of cars waiting in front of the banks. Or even park their cars right at the junction. Put a policeman there within visibility and, suddenly, all drivers behave like model citizens! But then, have you ever seen a policeman in Penang? I forget what they look like for not having seen them in the streets for years.
And what does the old government do about it? Nothing at all, cos it’s all “ok mah!”.
And the suggestion of trams? Let’s not decide on something temporary that will last for 15 years. Most government projects for Penang is designed and implemented 10 years later. By then, the population would have increased, cars would have doubled, even more housing and prices would have gone up. Talking about white elephants, there’s Komtar to look at. We need forward looking visionaries as government. Of course, Koh Tsu Khoon and visionary is an oxymoron.
A visionary would predict our travel habits for the next 100 years.
Dear Anil
I have not been well lately; hence I did not write to you.
Yes, this is exactly I wrote to you sometime ago that when
I landed in Penang in 1950, I saw Trams running along jalan Penang. I trust Penangites dreams will come true.
Guan Eng should draw up a new Plan to bring back Penang
as a City which it was. The previous politicians purposely destroyed and downgraded it - but now it is up to DAP with the assistance of others to rebuild the city.
In 1960 Singapore was similar to Penang but it has been completely beautified. It can be done and it must be done.
I pray.
Hamid Ibrahim
Anil,
I am trying again for the fourth time to send this comment.
What about trolley buses? It may be more feasible bec you don’t have to lay tracks.
Justin Choo
Although i’d like to see trams in Penang, it cost way too much to implement a decent tram system, lets no forget the maintainance of such a system and whether we have the expertise… me thinks trains are the way to go..
Well, can the current bus service be improved first? Consolidate/buyout all the inefficient bus companies into one organization owned by the state, put some capable people to manage it, and hire your own drivers & maintanence teams instead of subcontracting/renting out the buses. That way, you don’t have to worry about competition of routes, schedules, and fares.
Otherwise if you just add trams, you’re gonna make the situation far worse than it is…
well mr.anil,
i still follow up your dream project buts its seems your gang of bloggers forgoten about it by now.
i dont see the sign of banners in their blogs anymore.You are consistent but some are not.I came to know about your blogs throu some blogs owner mention highly about u but this guy doesnt support u.
This what i call human-will champion others until they are famous than they champion for themself.
rajraman666.wondering who am i championing.
hei there anil & hamid ibrahim!!! I agree with you … we need to bring Penang back to what it was. Thanks to the previous ‘jokers’ .. Penang had lost it’s city status. i wonder .. how can a city simply be downgraded to a town??? hhmmmm … so .. now i hope and pray that with Guan Eng as our C.M., we will be able to regain the city-stats and also … bring the TRAMS back into the city. being the younger generation, i never did get the opportunity to see the trams of penang. enjoyed riding on them in Melbourne and fell in love with it though. LET’S DO IT!!! … Let’s revive the TRAMS in PENANG!!!
Trams for Penang? I would urge everyone of you to consider this very carefully. I live in Melbourne. The streets here are much, much wider than those in Penang. And yet we have acute congestions where tram lines run. If your aim is to present Penang in a more “romantic” light, I’ll say “go for it”. But if it is to ease traffic congestions, my advice is, don’t do it. Monorails, though more expensive initially, would in my humble opinion be a better option if solving the traffic nightmare in Penang is the ultimate aim.
Yep, Trams For Penang and Penang For Trams. So be it!
Anil,
Wrong link for Stephen Doss blog posting.It should be;
http://stephendoss.blogspot.com/2008/05/penangites-for-trams.html
Anyway, this is good project for our lovely Penang. Well done!
[...] far at least 20 bloggers have joined in the campaign. That’s brilliant! Click here to see the full list. If you are a blogger and you want to join in the campaign, just leave a [...]
I am in too !
Here’s my two sen worth.
I stayed in Melbourne, Australia for three years where trams are its common mode of public transport within Greater Melbourne.
Yes, trams gives the city some elegance and “cuteness”, but it also comes with a great deal of discipline on the part of pedestrians, commuters and motorists.
In Melbourne, trams have the right of way. PERIOD. No IFs or BUTs about it. Whenever a tram stops to pick up or drop off a passenger, motorists following behind stops. Since its lines are in the middle of the road where the stops are situated, whenever passengers wishes to get off/on, they have the right of way to cross the road, and motorists stops. Whenever trams wishes to turn at the traffic lights, motorists give way.
I really cannot see Malaysians (be it Penangites or locals from elsewhere) doing the same here. I would like to be proven wrong !!
Dear Supporters of TRAMP IN PENANG,
GREAT IDEA BUT IS IT PRACTICAL & APPLICABLE..?
I agree to this idea but only have 1 question to it. Look at the size or rather width of our Penang City Streets, eg,Penang Road,Beach Street,Chulia Street,Burma Road,CArnavon Street..etc which consist of our major Penang City Streets.
Question is is it wide enough to put up a Tramp that goes 2 ways and still allow the usage of cars,lorrys,vans,motobikes,rickshaw.etc to travel on it.
At the moment it is already and almost immposible to expand the width of the access roads which we are using so how to add in a TRAMP SYSTEM on the same road space…?
Can someone enlighted me on this or some expert town planning people explain the feasibility of this project first.
Then we can see if it is practical and applicable..I just cannot imagine where to put it or how it can be done even though it is a Nobel Idea and I support it.
Desmond Lee
With trams there’s always a romantic notion
Whatever the actual speeds for their motion
They bring along their uniqueness to the nation
Let’s get the trams back and not miss the next station
(C) Samuel Goh Kim Eng - 010608
http://MotivationInMotion.blogspot.com
Sun. 1st June 2008.
Dear Anil,
You can put my blog name down as supporting the “Penangites for Trams” campaign, if you want.
My blog world messenger
Buses for Penang??? I would be the first to say yes BUT subject to what their routes would be. Bus services should begin from points outside Georgetown City itself. Bus/Tram terminals should be located at such points as Jelutong (around Bukit Dumbar or Tesco area), Ayer Itam Road (near Han Chiang High School) and Tanjong Tokong area (near the fire station/temporary Hawker stall site. While these are suggested locations for bus services to begin and tram ser4vices to end, the MPPP can review and look at other possible alternatives. Bus services should should begin from these terminals to radiate outwards to Bayan Lepas,Balik Pulau, Telok Bahang, Batu Feringgi, Ayer Itam and the out lying areas of Penang while tram services should be from the same terminals and proceed into all parts of the city itself. Trams can be designed to be ’slimmer’ to ensure that not much ’space’ is taken when the trams travel through the city. ‘Mat rempits’, selfish drivers or rickshaw riders etc., will remain a problem IRRESPECTIVE of whether buses or trams are allowed to run through the city. As such, control of these ‘road demons’ should be the problem of the police. Be aware that the provision of Tram service will be more beneficial to the city (less exhaust fumes,tourist attraction) than exhaust spewing buses in the hands of dangerous drivers.
Look at world most liveable city like Melbourne, Adelaide and Endingurh, they are all choosing tram.
Look at poorly manage transport like Kuala Lumpur, LRT is not integrated well, or is it?
Please study carefully population of Penang. MRT is only for large cities. If you implemented MRT on Penang island, you would go bankcrupt.
What historical city like Georgetown needs is to implement (very much lower cost than monorail) tram network like Melbourne. Have you visited Melbourne? By the way, Melbourne city is 10 times larger than Georgetown. Correct?
The whole Penang state population still could not match Melbourne.
Is tram in San Francisoc nice? It is just romantic.
Tram is a tourist product as well as could replace RapidPenang going around inner city of Georgetown. Why? Try to ride on tram in Melbourne and you would know why. Feel it yourself.
Tram could also be fast deployed on 3rd left lane of Penang Bridge when the extention completed by UMNO company UEM.
Monorail could have NO WAY to use existing Penang bridge but tram track could be laid on present Penang Brdige.
SO, where is the wisdom of the leaders and Penangites? If you want fast public transport to be on island and pay low commuter ticket, go for tram!
KL LRT is messy. Look at Melbourne and Adelaide first.
Please look at world top 30 cities first: who are they? By identifying who are they, you would see more clearly what are they?
http://www.citymayors.com/features/quality_survey.html
Tram is suitable for narrow streets like those in Europe.
Try to visit world most liveable Melbourne and feel it.
Anak Pulau Pinang:
Please see here - Trams don’t take up a lot of road space
See at benefits of tram - http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/internet/transport/public_transport/trams/cec_edinburgh_tram_benefits
http://www.worldofstock.com/search_pages/tram.php
So write to your Penang state government at http://www.penang.gov.my/index.php?ch=29
[...] The tram initiative is building up momentum. So far, 25 bloggers and websites have signed on to the campaign. [...]
I think it should be supported.
If only we have lots of these in KL. Count me in.
Bravo,
Good effort Anil.
Hopefully the new state government and dumb federal government will open thier eyes and ears, not thier pockets.
I’ve taken trams in Manchester (or was it Liverpool? I can’t remember) and in San Francisco. Absolutely love them. I believe this is totally possible in Penang, my state of birth. :)) Imagine the tourist possiblities too!
One thing I noticed about San Francisco’s tram - the line goes around the city in such a way that whereever you get down you can walk to your destination. Then again, SF is a pretty small city and it’s easy to walk every where.
The tram routes in Penang could function very much the same way. It doesn’t have to zig zag around the streets of Penang. It could just circle the town so that people can get down and walk to their destination …
Oh, if I remember correctly, the tram in Liverpool/Manchester has a barrier between it and the road. So, if you’re worried about pesky pedestrians and cars criss crossing the lane, that could work too.
PS count me as a blogger that supports this initiative..
What I’ve read so far:
Tram, don’t take up a lot of road space. For any good public transportation to work that competes with car for space on the road, it would need its own dedicated lane on the road. Now, how do you do that on the road in Georgetown?
Before you want to do that, might as well have the dedicated bus lane as the main backbone for the public transport. But that itself would be difficult because of the road condition in Georgetown.
Tram can only work effectively if there is a good bus system that compliments it but if the bus system is deplorable, how do you expect people to abandon their car and take the tram instead. Tram are not able to stop in front of the destination that you’re going (most of the time) so you’ll still need to use the bus to reach your destination. And with our inconsistence bus service in Penang, how long would a normal journey take? Oh I forgot, most of the people who support the tram do not use the public transport in Penang. Most of tram supporter have seen and took the tram before in other country before and would like Penang to implement it. Well I’m sure in those countries, you can see a lot of people cycling to their destination but would you promote that in Penang? Would you let your teenage son/daughter to cycle to school or to Georgetown?
Just because it is ‘clean, energy saving and user-friendly not to mention fast, efficient and also cheap’, it looks good on other place doesn’t mean it is feasible in Penang
Most of the country that have tram is a 1st world country where most of it have wide road compare that to the congested small road in Penang with no more room for expansion unless you want to tear down the >80+ building found along Georgetown
Even if ‘Melbourne city is 10 times larger than Georgetown and that the whole Penang state population still could not match Melbourne.’, Penang island is denser than Melbourne:
Melbourne population / area : 3,806,092 / 2153 km² = 1767/ km2
Penang Island : 678,000 / 295 km2 = 2298/ km2
Data taken from Wikipedia
Is that the end of it? Nope. Kindly open up Google Earth and check out Penang Island and compare that to Melbourne. You’ll notice that Penang Island is make up of more than 50% hill and it is concentrated mostly in 1/3 of the west side of the island. So if we were to take this into account, our density should be 678,000 / 100km2 = 6780 km2. That is 4-5 times denser than Melbourne
If you want to have tram in Georgetown, you must ensure that there is a sizeable people who will abandon their car and use it. Road user would not like the idea that there is going to be a tram competing with them on the narrow road of Georgetown. At least monorail and the subway system would not compete with road user.
To Khoo San,
‘Hong Kong’s tram is working smoothly after 100 years of service and tram is considered an effective mode of transport.’
They can do that as they got a good bus system as a backbone to support it. Do we have that in Penang?
There was also a plan to use back the old tram road on Penang road. I wonder how senior citizens are going to cross safely to the sidewalk with all the mat rempit around. Ever thought of that?
To lucialai,
I’ve downloaded the PowerPoint by Ric Francis and notice one thing about it. Did you notice that all the tram that is available in other cities does not have traffic condition similar to Penang and I don’t see a lot of mat rempit in it. And about the propose tram route in Georgetown by Ric, I don’t see it doing any better than what a good bus system would provide instead. More comfortable ride? We’re not living in Penang as a tourist
Don’t get me wrong on this, if we have the extra space around in Georgetown, we don’t have mat rempit roaming around, we got an excellent bus service, people would actually give up driving then I’m all for the tram service
Please do not learn the mentality of BN, just because a plan sound and look good, they want to implement it. But with the delivery system not existing at all, it is usually swept under the carpet.
1.can you justify the actual cost involve including the hidden cost.
2.can you please estimate the profits or return on investment.
3.Your ealier costing is very low and very tempting for business people if you can prove its profitable.
I believed you as accountant already workout a formula in your mind.
The figure you quoted is very low and my idea is simple as follows-
1.If the amount to revive the tram is low and the Penang chief minister can buy your teory the money should be none issue.
WHY THE MONEY IS NONE ISSUE.
1.Alots of malaysian still cash rich.
2.Returns of fixed deposit is mere 3%.
3.The public can be your investor ( with such low sum,u can create malaysian public to invest in your dream.)
MR.ANIL - EVERYONE HAVE A DREAM AND EVERYDAY WE DREAM - I CAN BET MY LAST PENNIES IF YOU DO A BIT MORE PUSH IN YOUR DREAM PROJECT-your dreams will become a reality.Lets this project become malaysian holding company.
I am in as a small minority shareholder in your dream.Its up to you to pursue further.
rajraman-still dreaming in my dream to be malaysian putra.
Done and added to my blog…
Dear Anil,
IMHO, Penang island is a unique place where many roads (especially in town area) are narrow and short. To overcome traffic congestions we need to stop or discourage vehicles into the traffic in order for mass public transportation like buses, tramps to arrive on time.
The cheapest and quickest way is to shutdown certain roads and to give priority to public buses, bas kilang, school buses etc. I guess this can be carried out almost immediately. This idea may sound drastic or unwelcome to many of us who have our own cars but is good for all.
[...] will! And perhaps, a bit of intensive lobbying by us Malaysians. Penang bloggers are lobbying for trams in the Penang (I’m all for that). Perhaps Selangor bloggers can lobby for pedestrian and biking lanes in [...]
I am all for it. Come to think of it I might even come back to Penang for my retirement
I think trams will come later in the future. Focus on the task at hand to improve the bus services in Penang. Then only talk about trams.
Good idea but very expensive to implement.
Expensive, maybe, but still a lot cheaper than monorail (and minus the ugly pillars) or subway.
And yes, the buses need to be improved. No reason why that can’t be done together with looking at other modes of public transport.
Well for me, I’ll support anything that can help to improve lovely Penang. May it be monorail or trams, both would be wonderful for Penang(wonderful alternative to ease the congestions and also a superb tourists attraction).
Proudly on BalikPulau.org blog too for some time now, Anil
really am enjoying your blog posts…
Yes! bring them back!
See my corporation and funding proposals at http://ctchoolaw.blogspot.com/2008/07/penangs-public-transportation-radical.html