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20 Responses to “New beginning for public transport - from the bottom up”

1. kesava on June 26th, 2008 at 6.22pm

   Good news indeed. Now get those trams moving.

2. khensthoth on June 26th, 2008 at 7.09pm

   That sounds more viable than a tram system, at least to me. If you are advocating a tram system, let it be known your proposal. This is what I have said in other internet forum:

   I have voiced my concern in other post and I will do so again.

   Although I am not entirely supportive of monorail, I am even more sceptical of trams in George Town. Living in Melbourne currently, here’s what I feel about tram:

   Noisy. Ugly (overhead cables). Do not really blend with the surrounding, even more so with George Town - c’mon newish trams with old cities? Some even suggested getting old trams so it will blend with the environment. What’s the logic behind that?

   In narrow roads (like the most of George Town), trams are actually bottleneck and a cause of congestion. With Penangites’ attitude of using more private vehicles, I don’t see how tram will currently be able to work in Penang. I have no idea why so many people are supportive of it.

   Surely trams will cost more than buses. Improve the current bus system first. Exploit and capitalise all available opportunity before moving to a another mass transit. We need public transportation at the moment - not mass transit.

   I don’t want another tourist gimmick in the city. I want something viable. So, let’s see what are the proposal submitted and we shall decide.

   I personally do think the bus system, if seriously well planned and implemented, is much better and suited for Penangites. RapidPenang is not too bad actually, they just do not have enough buses to guarantee frequency (and they are a little too expensive). Couple this with the fact that traffic congestions are a norm in Penang, the way to start is to educate people first about using public transport.

   One way I see how the other bus companies in Penang can survive, and help make Penang better, is to form a joint-venture, and ply routes that RapidPenang do not ply, or complement RapidPenang’s routes so the bus frequency is increased. It’s a win-win situation. It’s good in theory, but sadly in practice there is bound to be problem.

   Why other bus companies aren’t exploring this idea, instead of arguing like children about unfair competition, threatening Rapidpenang drivers and acting like street thugs (samseng) , I have no idea.

   All that being said, I still want to look at their suggestions. Do they seriously want to bring the “old tram” feel to George Town, or are they going to get new modern trams and start modernising the city itself? The question still remains.

3. malaysia born on June 26th, 2008 at 7.36pm

   If there are any transport system to emulate, it is the Japan transport system.

   Having lived in Tokyo and Nagoya, I find the system there simple awesome. Considering that the streets of Tokyo are congested but the s=buses there are run on time and destinations are announced in the busese beforehand and the buzzer that they use in the buses are just simply fantastic! All one needs to do is just press the buzzer once and should anyone press it next, it won’t sound thus eliminating the annoying buzzing sound to the driver!

   On top of that, the buses are all clean and drivers are smartly dressed.

   Another best thing about the Japan system is that there are time tables at every bus stops and they ACTUALLY keep to the time indicated. Should a bus arrive 2 minutes BEFORE the schduled time of arrival, the bus will wait for for 2 minutes and should the bus arrive 2 minutes late, the bus driver will APOLOGISED to all boarding passengers!

   Now that’s the system that Penang should aim for ….if only to show the Federal government how to run a world class bus transport system. Get that system in place and i guarantee you everyone in penang will be abandoning their cars and me a KL-ite will drive up to penang n just leave it at the hotel car park! Now that’s world class living for you!

   I am 48 years old now. Will i be able to see such a system in my country during my life time?

4. Juan Taman on June 26th, 2008 at 10.29pm

   DAP now rules Penang. Prepare a comprehensive people- affordable traffic plan for Penang. Negotiate with the Federal government for funding the plan.
   DAP has to be proactive rather than waiting for goodies from the Federal.

5. esgreat on June 26th, 2008 at 10.47pm

   Why have Malaysians been so dependent on government? It’s commendable to improve public transport. But in the long run, we MUST take economic planning out of the government’s hands.

   The reason why privatization failed in the past was because certain parties with special interest had ‘friends’ in government. These in turn were linked with government-related socialist programs, like NEP, Approved Permits (AP), economic planning. All the corruption we’ve seen had always been at the stage of bureaucrats, secret contracts…anything government-linked.

   This state of decadence cannot be solved by having more government involvement. The solution lies in giving more freedom to the rakyat. Freedom to the ’small’ people, NGOs (plenty in PG), etc who have great ideas and drive..who have been stifled by restrictions, regulations, bureaucracy…many of which were put in place for the special interest groups and big well-linked corporations.

   I’m certain that with minimal government involvement, we can enjoy low tax and our private citizens will shine, engineering the solution. Look at the successful Chinese schools, welfare organizations, Penang Free School (in glory days)…they were all built by groups private citizens. They started to decline when government was involved.

   I end this with a few characteristics of fascism I observed:-
   - The promotion of ‘greatness’ of a certain race, creed, etc
   - Nationalization, Racism, domination of a single religion
   - Economic planning by government (good intentions in trying to solve issues, but making them worse, and has to resort to various patch-up programs and funding - look at our BN gov’s patch up funding)
   - Groups in government hailing the ‘leader’ and being obedient dogs to him and no dissent
   -

   Let’s not use crisis as an excuse to give more power to the government. The great US constitution (which is largely unheeded by the US, to their detriment) envisioned by its founders was highly focused on restricting the power of government. (Ron Paul supporter here )

6. A true Malaysian on June 27th, 2008 at 12.09am

   It is a blessing indeed for not continue the monorail an porr. Monorail and porr will aggravate traffic congestion problem in Penang. Just look at what is happening in KL.

   There is no other way to solve this congestion problem other than to control car population on the road and have a good system for bus route. Just learn from Singapore. JB is too proud to learn from Singapore, but not Penang, I hope.

7. A true Malaysian on June 27th, 2008 at 12.25am

   Guan Eng,

   I shake your hand in DAP PJ CNY open house and wish u good luck. It turned out just nice.

   Hope u make yourself into Bapa Penang Moden.

   Good luck again. Don’t let BN look ’suay’ on u.

8. Remie on June 27th, 2008 at 8.56am

   I fully agree that this is a golden opportunity to turn my island home state into a model of public transportation similar to my adopted residence, Singapore.

   Tear away the UMBO/BN box of opportunism & greed, dump the 2nd Penang bridge, at the same time.

   Let all with environmental interest in Penang, come together with a new blueprint on transportation within Penang, and some say Seberang Prai, too. Let Penang be the envy of Selangor, Johor, Kelantan and Perak as we see necktied executives riding our air-con buses/trams to work daily.

   All come together now and make it a reality. I shall contribute from far away for a good reason to visit my home state more often than now.

9. The Yarning on June 27th, 2008 at 9.46am

   This is great, keep the discussion and suggestions coming, let’s hear it from all sides and hope the state gov will be more proactive and inclusive in their decision-making and treat this as an opportunity to, like said above : start something great from ground up. It’s sad that all the newspapers are concentrating on is this person or another upset, and some blogs ought to stop fanning the BN doing this to punish Penangites idea.

10. pinangroup on June 27th, 2008 at 9.48am

    kensthoth: the trams are still in proposal stage, knowing how things work it will take some time, 5-10 years before we see anything. i’m sure all issues will be carefully thought out. perhaps start small and grow from there like most train networks.

    malaysia born: you’re asking for a mentality and mindset change, it will take more than spanking new buses with gadgetry. s’pore has a good one as well, and i recall some family friend who went there to become a bus driver, had to go through a few rounds of interview, and several months of training before they even hit the road. of course the pay is much better too. it will also take some time to see that happen if we start now.

    juan: i think it’s clear now, the federal is shelving a lot of plans, political reasons or not i don’t wish to speculate, but like anil, i believe it’s a good thing. the island is small, we just need a good bus system like what malaysia born has stated, and that includes the change of mentality.

    everyone needs to play their part if we want to improve, the people factor might be the hardest to reform, but if we can get through that, things will start rolling. bus companies can take this opportunity for a change, the money first mentality has got to go, provide a good service and the money will come in many folds as public transportation will be in demand as fuel price continue to rise. the people has to be patient too and not expect an overnight miracle.

11. Kah Seng on June 27th, 2008 at 10.09am

    Monorail and PORR could still “start in the 10th Malaysia Plan.” So civil society, better get involved in the planning now.

    http://themalaysianinsider.com/index.php/home/42-lead-stories/1096-penang-sore-with-shelved-monorail-ring-road-projects

    “Critics say Abdullah is punishing his home state for voting in the Opposition coalition of Lim’s Democratic Action Party (DAP) and its partner the Parti Keadilan Rakyat (PKR) but government officials denied the allegations, saying the projects could start in the 10th Malaysia Plan.”

    —-

    khensthoth,

    About tram. True, biggest problem will be it hogs the surface road. I lived in HK for a while, one street away from tram way in Wanchai. I am a regular user and appreciator of the HK tram.

    But HK has so few cars and such a dense population that the tram works.

    True also the wiring is ugly looking.

    Cars have to stop behind trams when trams stop, most of the time not able to overtake even though there are fewer cars in HK than on Penang streets. The stopping is also for the safety of pedestrians crossing the road (in front of the tram, unseen to the cars) after alighting from the tram.

    But to be fair, the tram was only effective because it forms part of HK’s public transport system, which include underground mass transit, double decker buses that cross harbour, ferries, minibuses (van size) on 3km runs, tram, escalators, and easily available taxis.

    But most notable is the surprisingly extensive pedestrian walkways that are mostly covered and which inter-connectd office buildings, malls, residential blocks, parks, water front, mass-mover escalator, underground mass-transit stations, and wrap under elevated roads.

    Shops along the walkways benefit a lot with increased sale volume, and can pay more assessment tax, I suppose.

12. esgreat on June 27th, 2008 at 10.36am

    I realized that there are many houses in Penang that are not accessible through the main roads (i.e. you need to walk a long distance through many small roads to reach a place accessible by buses and taxis).

    Furthermore the roads are so split out that public transport can’t possibly service all the routes. An integrated tram/taxi/bus system would be good for the town center, but not for access to housing areas. I think that lack of access to their houses encourages them to use cars and to not even think of public transport.

    I think what can be done is to create several small transportation terminals within a certain housing area, complete ample parking lots. Thus commuters will drive a short distance (~1km) from their homes and “plug in” to enjoy the fully integrated system. The center can even double as a community center, sports center, or retail hub.

    The next step would be to have a good delivery system for goods bought from shops. This will obviate the need of driving for picking up goods.

13. Old Timer on June 27th, 2008 at 11.00am

    “Good posts all round. here’s mine which I sent o Vox populi before I saw yours on the same topic :

    I refer to the topic - EPU: Penang monorail, Porr shelved - and note the valid points but I think maybe the main and critical issue has been missed.

    The main problem with Penang is the many vehicles plying its roads thus contributing to its perennial taffic jams and gridlocks.

    Singapore has faced the same problems in its early days and there are many similarities between Penang and Singapore in ithis regard.

    Personally, I feel there is little need to re-invent the wheel. If Singapore has alredy traversed he same road, it would be an intelligent move to seek them out on thier comprehensive urban transportation system. Much of the answers and solutions to Penang’s problems are already available.

    The remedy by the Mahathir Adminstration in building more roads and making more cars to put on the roads is not the answer. Perhaps they knew the answer but their eventual decisions and the underlying motives for the remedy undertaken, as we all perceive, is, or was, highly questionable. Our urban tansportation system - if it can be called that - is still a bloody mess.

    The Penang State Government is in a uniquely and privileged position at present. Since the Federal Government has passed the “baton” over on this matter, the Hon. Lim Guan Eng, his new Cabinet team, and State Administrators, have the opportunity to show their stuff perhaps, in managing the develoment of a comprehensive urban transportation system. The political capital is now in their hands. The Hon. Lim Guan Eng and his team should make a detailed study of Singapore’s System and implement it in Penang and lobby the Federal Government wherever is needed now, so as to clear the path for this project.

    Even if you are unable to leave any other legacy behind by the time your administartion is completed, do leave at least an efficient and effective transportation system behind. You will be remembered for it.

    I look forward to Mr Lim and his men to proceed and make Penang into another first world “Singapore”. I am sure they have the blessings of many Penangnites and other Malaysians.

    Don’t forget however, at the same time, the spiritual and cultural side. Remember to develop and help promote and instill the Baba-Nyonya heritage also in all Babas and Nyonyas - ie all those born in Malaysia since prior to the year 1400. Be like Korea where there is or was, all-rounded development. Do not replicate Singapore’s weakness in this very important area of human capital development.

    Old Timer “

14. khensthoth on June 27th, 2008 at 1.14pm

    I’ve been to Hong Kong before, and the public transport works because there’s integrated planning and implementation in different kinds of transport.

    Honestly, my feeling about Hong Kong tram is just awful. It’s so small everyone is cramped, it’s hard to even move around. However, the price of using the tram was extremely cheap.

    What I am questioning here is if the “Penangites for Tram” initiative has a well thought out plan. A lot of the bloggers just jump on the bandwagon of supporting it without critically analysing the proposal.

    Some say tram has produce no pollution. Relatively speaking, that’s true. However, trams or any kind of electrical public transportation just move the pollution away from the city. You still need the power (fossil fuel) to power the tram. It moves the pollution away from the city to the Power Plant.

    The point is, people are blindly advocating that they themselves do not understand fully.

15. Albert on June 27th, 2008 at 3.48pm

    I am echoing khensthoth’s 1st comment, that reviving the bus system is the best short term measure we can have now. Let’s reflect back how is the bus system worked back in the 80’s. Different bus company cater for different geographical areas. Penang folks, still remember ‘Lim Seng Seng’, ‘Sri Negara’, ‘Hin Bus’, ‘Yellow Bus’? And not forgetting the ‘government bus’ also. As far as I can remember, public transportation back then was fairly efficient, I don’t even have to take taxis then, in fact I never took taxi when I was a kid.

    We can always take cue from the past. Let’s form territorial bus companies, with each company plying certain geographical area and run deep into housing areas. Each bus company should has their own hub in their own territory and are allow to have 1 or 2 main lines that connect to a Main Hub and between each other hub. Of course there will be certain localised lines that will be loss-making, there is where the state government can chip in to provide financial assistance to ensure adequate coverage of buses, and bus companies should not operate solely based on profit but CSR as well.

    Well, I think this is gonna to work, and I hope somebody could relay this idea to the Chief Minister, Anil, perhaps?

16. Andrew on June 27th, 2008 at 4.30pm

    If we are ever going to realize an efficient public transport system, some drastic and unpopular measures will have to be implemented. Needless to say, a huge amount of political will is required.

    Singapore, which is under what could best be described as a sustainable dictatorship, has shown that if the masses are made to fully understand the reasoning behind social policies, then greater public cooperation will be forthcoming.

    For far too long, Malaysians have taken the easy way out. A change in attitudes is long overdue. Remember the advertising campaigns carried out in the 90’s to encourage car pooling. Only now, is this slowly and begrudgingly becoming acceptable.

    The social stigma attached to having to rely on public transport places another barrier to really developing it. If Singaporeans are labelled as being more kiasu then we are, and they have accepted public housing and transport as an inevitable fact of life, then shouldn’t we as Malaysians be able to rise to the occasion just to prove our point?

17. jughead on June 27th, 2008 at 5.06pm

    Many in favour of tram because it is something new, cute and novel to them. But it is only meant for short distance because it is slow. As Kah Seng said, when the tram stop, the cars have to stop because passengers are dropping off. Otherwise, everyday someone will get hit unless protective islands on centre of the roads are built. This means the cars cannot share the same space as trams if protective islands are built.

    PORR can be abandoned because due to petrol prices going up, people will turn to public transport IF they are relatively good. So why expressways if there are less cars? Expressways are for longer distance and Monorails should be built as MASS TRANSIT to move people from one township to the city or to another township. They take less time and can be punctual. Meanwhile, there should be more buses - express bus at certain morning and even peak are more bus lanes. Or streets meant for buses only at certain times. This encourage people to take more public transport. Now, we have to train malaysians to take more public transport instead of driving and yet wants free parking of park infront of his destination

18. jughead on June 28th, 2008 at 10.21am

    The beauty of Penang is that it is a small island surrounded by water. Instead of PORR, why not use water transport. From South East End, ferry boats can made a few stops to the city and to north part. No need to build roads, land acquistion and no traffic jams. There should also be a ferry service from southern end to Prai so that people need not to go to the city to catch the ferry. The Penang Port can start this service. Think laterally!!!

19. Kah Seng on June 28th, 2008 at 8.29pm

    OK, the bottom line: Our transport woes stem from NEP.

    Under the NEP, commercial licensing power was concentrated in the Ministry of Entrepreneur and Cooperatirves (besides the Economic Planning Unit under PM’s office and Finance Ministry).

    Under that Ministry is the CVLB, or Commercial Vehicle Licensing Board. The CVLB controls the licensing for buses, taxis, some ferries, all kinds of commercial transport. It picks the crony licensees by connection, not by competence, efficiency, or inter-coordication.

    Now matter how much we howl, as long as the zombie NEP (which has expired but has not expired) is undead, the gain for the minority UMNOputeras will be a greater motivation than the loss for the majority of Malaysians — Malay, Chinese, India, Iban, Khadazan included.

    As our local environmentalist Dato’ Dr. Leong Yueh Kwong said in a slide presentation:

    “The problems may be technical, or social or economic, but the solution is political”
    (See last page of PDF http://tinyurl.com/24jemm)

    Oh, and be careful not to fall into the trap of the BN whines of “let’s not politicise this and politicise that.” That’s UMNO-MCA-Gerakan speak for let’s not solve the problem.

    —

    To repeat an obvious points others have commented: What we need is a system, a network.

    We need to create a spectrum of services and costs, so that different people, in different situations, different affordabilities, at different times, can fill their needs at satisfactory cost. For example, I may take minibus to work, but tram back, and taxi on the same road when I rush.

    This is because each mode has its advantages and disadvantages - for different people, situation, timing.

    Ferry is flexible and cheap, but slow and limited to sea front access.

    Bus is flexible, but pollutes and needs bus number, rider number, lanes, and is difficult to set up in terms of regulation. HK sets up 2 to compete indirectly, so that they yield operating benchmarks for each other. HK uses a “return on investment” approach to regulate fare, and to bias decisions toward investment and upgrade.

    Monorail is lighter on investment and construction than electric rail, but is slower and carry fewer. Above ground rail is cheaper than underground, but is highly intrusive to property value and city heritage.

    Tram is easy to start, but hogs road, and the cheap initial footprint does not reach real population centers (Farlim, Rifle Range, Kampong Melayu, Paya Terubong, MacCallum flats, etc). Tram is clean for city center but a small footprint likely cannot recoup investment (so not sustainable).

    Taxi is flexible, necessary, but a sustainable fare system will be expensive. Political solution can help by lowering licensing and vehicular costs.

    —

    Ultimately, it is still a NEP problem.

20. Albert on July 4th, 2008 at 5.55pm

    Penang Chief Minister is lobbying for the 2 mega projects to be reinstated. That is the Monorail and PORR. Listing a lot of benifits if having the 2 projects continue.

    What say you, Anil?

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